I’ll start of by saying my bike is optimised for my comfort
That said, I do some fast group rides and I’m genuinely curious how much speed I’m giving up in exchange for said comfort
I have a Giant Revolt Advanced 2 for road riding. This is Giant’s carbon gravel bike with a rigid fork. I chose this because the combination of stack and reach make it very comfortable for me: https://www.giant-bicycles.com/gb/revolt-advanced-2
This version of the Revolt runs 2x12 Shimano whichi s 46-30T on the front and 11-36T on the rear.
I can keep up with the group but I have to work for it
I could buy a more aero bike, I could get narrower handlebars, a more aero helmet etc. but would this make a big difference? Am I just less fit - which is hard to answer.
When I looked into Tour Magazine numbers it’s the amount of watts needed to get to 45kph. I almost never see 45kph on a flat road in a group ride.
So I’m curious, am I giving up a big performance gain on group rides by riding what is essentially a road converted gravel bike.
Being comfortable is probably the biggest performance gain you can have, so you are at a good starting point.
I have recently tested a gravel and a road bike in the wind tunnel, the Avona Callis and Avona Velum. With road tires on the gravel bike, the difference becomes marginal. Obviously, the Callis is an aero optimized gravel bike and very close in design to the Velum, so it is not that much of a surprise the two bikes are not far apart in drag. I am not sure about the Revolt‘s exact shapes, but expect it to be aerodynamically close to a road bike with similar shapes., probably 15 - 25 W more than the typical World Tour bike at 45 km/h. Cut that in half if you are going 35 km/h, or even lower if you are in the slipstream of others. Obviously you position is more important than your bike. If the Revolt allows you to get your shoulders and head as low as you can sustain, actually the higher bars are most likely more aerodynamic than if you had a bike with lower stack.
If you want to further upgrade your bike, the first point would be to get better tires. If you get Continental GP5000 S TR (hard to get past those), we are looking at about 10 W at 30 km/h (assuming you are already using tubeless), more than you could possibly get from aerodynamics. My next step would be a waxed chain. If you really want to get your bike more aero, invest in aero bars first those can be worth 5-9 W at 45 km/h.
Not on group rides (except maybe for tires). Sounds like you wouldn’t be using changes to go faster, you’d be using them to go easier – but since your current bike is optimized for comfort, that may not matter much. That’s why I asked what you would do with the information.
You know that power varies (approximately) with the cube of speed, so speed varies (approximately) with the cube root of power. That means that a aero drag savings may not translate into much difference in speed but it can translate into a reasonable savings in effort. But you’re not getting dropped by the group anyway. So get better tires and hide in the group, and the difference in effort will outweigh riding out front and fighting the air alone.
If you were using the original TLs (not TRs), they were an absolute bear to get on; the newer TRs aren’t exactly easy, but they are easier. A tire jack can help.
It sounds like you’ve maxed out your optimisation with the frame you have and that you’re not really missing much. I’m just curious about the gearing. Do you find yourself running out of gears?
I don’t think you can really know the difference the frame makes without getting in a wind tunnel.
Other stuff:
Clothing: You don’t need the latest ribbed wonderfabric, but anything loose or flapping will cost you speed.
An aero helmet might make sense when it is time for a new one.
Agree on using the fastest tires that make sense for your conditions. If you don’t want to go tubeless, latex or TPU tubes save a few watts over butyl.
I don’t know that any of us can give you an actual answer on how much slower it is. But I have a revolt as my gravel bike and an Aeroad as my road bike, I’ve got 40mm Hutchinson Caracal Race on the Revolt and GP 30’s on the Aeroad. I have used the Revolt on easier Saturday road rides and even when it gets spicy, I can keep up no problem, but the Aeroad is definitely better for faster group rides.
Just make your life a little easier by taking care of the other stuff. Aero helmet, aero socks, race fit kit, carb it up, be smart about when to pull and when to sit in, and you’ll be good.
Very unlikely. At a cadence of 90 rpm you’ll do over 49 km/h in your tallest gear, 46:11 ≈ 4.18. You’d have to be a serious grinder (around 75 rpm) if you can only reach about 40 km/h in a 46:11. If your preferred cadence is that low, I’d seriously consider training yourself to broaden the range of acceptable cadences.
I used to have essentially the same gear on my road bike (42:10 = 4.20) and could pedal up until 65ish km/h. Of course, when the handlebars point downhill, you are not putting in appreciable power at high speeds anyway.
In any case, prioritize climbing gears over having top gears.
Your three best options to get “free speed” are:
Make sure you wear tight-fitting clothing. You can easily lose 30 W in additional drag due to clothing.
Body position: this is always going to be a compromise between comfort and speed. But you can make small tweaks to your body position to save quite a few watts.
Get faster tires. I’m a big fan of Vittoria tires. Upgrade from the N.EXT to their top-level Corsa or Corsa Control (for the offseason) tires. They are pretty fast rolling, but in my experience, top-shelf Vittoria tires have a magnificent ride quality.
It’s a common complaint, but despite bad roads I have never flatted with both, regular Corsas and Corsa Controls. We have very bad cobbles around here, so I am not gentile to my tired either.
On Pirelli tires I had an unfixable flat last year. Bad luck, perhaps.
The Corsa Controls are the better choice for the offseason: more grip at a modest increase of rolling resistance, better puncture protection and still a very supple ride. The nice thing is that you know when Hering bone pattern starts gripping when you corner. In the straight you are rolling on the bald, slick part.
Rent a road race bike sometime and see if you like the faster feel vs. the loss of comfort. A fairly inexpensive way to gather real data and experience on the topic.
I’m guessing you’re not American based on your reference to Tour Magazin, but if you’re familiar with baseball at all, you’ll have seen batters warming up while holding two bats instead of one. They do this so that their bat will feel lighter and faster when their turn comes at the plate. Right now, you’re using two bats, and if you decide to make the jump to a faster setup someday, you’ll feel faster - for a while anyway, until you get used to it. So, if you can hang now, you’re doing great, and making yourself stronger. Don’t worry about the rest.
30-50 watts, as some have hinted at, is a lot, but that’s well within the range of abilities you’d expect to see in a group ride. It would be noticeable to you (at first) but it won’t turn you into Pogacar overnight.
It’s a good question. I reckon 10-20 watts. I have an older road bike Wilier Cento1Air, with some middle of the road (pardon the pun) 50mm wheels 25mms tyres, and wonder what I’m giving up in watts and comfort.
As already stated your clothing, position, and other aero things have some influence here but on a group ride you can also tuck into the group which minimizes some of those things. I guess my first question is whether or not you are drafting effectively?
Next, rolling resistance is important. Not familiar with those particular tires but I don’t have the FTP to be trying to hang in a group ride on some slow tires like gatorskins.
Finally I don’t see much discussion of drive train maintenance but a poorly maintained drive train costs you some watts
Finally finally, you say you are able to hang with the group but you have to work for it. To me that sounds like how a good group ride should work
)