Agree, this can be really challenging to figure out.
I think the one thing that we can all agree on is that the cyclist’s power and durability are much more important factors than the tire that’s chosen. The fastest tire (whatever that is) won’t be enough for a strong amateur to beat a pro.
The confounding variable when we review pro results is something not everybody talks about a lot - sponsorship. Most of the top races have results dominated by sponsored pros - and sponsored pros ride what the sponsors provide.
This has turned into more of a thread on perceptions of why we believe something is good but that’s still interesting.
I think that successes to market share ratio is not as logical as it’s being made out to be. What’s market share? Is it advertising spend? Number of sponsored athletes? Total market share of all bikes?
RH are a largely well-known and respected name among people who are familiar with cycling. I’ve never seen one in real life, but I know of them. I’d posit that for that reason RH are already over-represented in a pro gravel field or endurance race vs “number of tyres currently on gravel bikes in the world”, if that’s how we define market share. Them being on a podium or top ten under these circumstances proves nothing, and probably indicates they’re within what’s very likely a pretty small performance window along with all the other good tyre options.
And is everyone rushing out to buy new tyres just because there’s a new tread pattern? There’s surely plenty of hype and marketing going on, but most of us aren’t burning $200 on a new set of tyres until we’ve somewhat worn an existing set out.
For me, RHs seem like they might be nice, but from the testing and reviews I’ve read they’re likely not $50AUD per tyre better than the Tufos I’m currently riding.
Hi everyone - I feel like this conversation about slicks vs knobbies has essentially run it’s course. It’s also overwhelmed this topic completely.
Sometime tomorrow I will rename this topic to “Gravel Tires - Slicks vs knobs” as I think the intention of the Topic hasn’t been met by the ensuing discussion. We can start a new Topic on gravel tires in general to continue that discussion if that’s useful. Perhaps individual topics for specific tires could also be useful.
If you’ve got some good experiences with various tires a great option would be to share a little review in Tech > Tech Reviews. This will really help demonstrate the pros/cons and shared experiences.
Also a gentle reminder for everyone to have a read of the forum’s Code of Conduct. Everyone has their own opinions and experiences and it’s really interesting to read lots of perspectives. If you don’t agree, that’s fine, it’s not a requirement. The first three point in key principles are key.
This forum is 1 week old and has a huge potential to become a great community for our members. Please help us get this off the ground by giving great first impressions as people check in.
Good points Jase, and thanks others for the craic. I hope the conversation gave new perspectives to folks, I picked up a number of points I’m going to investigate deeper for my own journalistic use.
I didn’t see it as a ‘Slicks vs. Knobblies’ debate - rather more to the core of how subjective something as seemingly simple as a tyre can be. With so many confounding factors, methods and perceptions to consider, is it even possible to say ‘this tyre is best’? I believe the clear answer is no - because the question is wrong. It should be ‘What tyre will on balance give me the best outcomes for my priorities A-B-C etc given my use cases X-Y-Z etc’ - so if you come to a forum like this looking for your next tyre, knowing how to frame your question is key. Closely followed by how to read suggestions from others with a critical eye - what’s their experience, what are they prioritising, etc.
And in responding, saying ‘Brand X Model Y is best’ is useless unless you’re stating your own priorities and use cases. That way there’s no ‘argument’ - because it’s lived experience that others may or may not recognise/align with.
Maybe we could collectively create a resource that solves that challenge - like a Twist-a-plot book that guides you to the best outcome / least compromise.
Yeah sorry I really should have caveated that with “For me, where and how I ride”. For my friends and customers too. But like every single recommendation or opinion hereabouts that is just my/our personal experience/opinion, take it for what it is.
It so happens a bunch of elite riders agree, or they wouldn’t be riding them (RH is the one brand where meaningful sponsorship money doesn’t come into it - because they don’t have any). Make of that what you will, it’s not an argument.
Meanwhile, Sofiane Sehili is 1,000km ahead of the FKT pace for riding across Eurasia, on the 38mm Barlow Pass tubeless slicks (Endurance casing). Go Sofiane!
Gravel Tires - Slicks, Tread or otherwise - there is no “best”
Again;
Also a gentle reminder for everyone to have a read of the forum’s Code of Conduct. Everyone has their own opinions and experiences and it’s really interesting to read lots of perspectives. If you don’t agree, that’s fine, it’s not a requirement. The first three point in key principles are key.
Ha ha. I actually tried this a while ago on my Runny Ass Antelope Hills. It was a disaster. I also have their tires in 35, and 38 mm x 700 and wont ride them on gravel anymore unless its very tame gravel. Too many punctures. My Rat Trap pass in 26 inch are my favorite Runny tire but I wont be buying them again. Great for commuting. I am trying to use the Antelopes right now. Despite having them for years and years I cant find a good use case for them.
I want to show some love for the Specialized Pathfinder Pro. I tried it on one bike and it was faster than admittedly slower options. It is currently my favourite until I try Thunderburts probably.
I’m currently running 48mm Tufo Thundero HDs. They feel relatively fast, at least to keep me competitive in races, but importantly have been absolutely bomb proof across the Traka 200 and The Gralloch. Certainly at the Gralloch they helped me gain a good 30+ places through avoiding mechanicals alone - I don’t want to take that risk for a small RR benefit. I’ve heard too many stories of TB punctures and horrible grip.
I am excited about the RX Pro, and will keep an eye on that with a view to switching out for gravel world champs if it continues to hold up well.
No, not for current trends. My gravgrav is quite old now, and the new version is not going wide at all. An interesting call on their part, OPEN UP. Had not heard of them, Tideace. Requiem 84? Looks great !
I think we get it… you like Rene Herse tyres (without trying any others). No problem with that but everyone knows it now and it’s dominating the thread.
I personally really like the 27.5 race kings w/ black chili for days when I just want to get out and ride. Super comfortable, fast rolling, good enough grip for the kind of muddy singletrack I can expect to tackle on a gravel bike and a very reasonable rolling diameter. Its about the same as 40mm Terra Speeds I used to run, and the 40mm Hutchinson Carcal Races I have currently on my 700c wheelset. They’ve been my favorite since like 2019ish and i plan to keep a stock of them until they stop making them.
That said, just because something is hard to feel or can’t be measured by someone in their garage, that doesn’t mean there isn’t a “better” option. An opinion is only worth the weight of consideration put into it. Tire design is a very technical field with a lot of things to consider, most of which is unfortunately well beyond my own understanding.
What I do know is that a company like Rene Herse or Ultradynamico that contract manufactures with Panaracer, doesn’t design their tread patterns to match usage and doesn’t have access to the same level of compound research will struggle against companies that pour R&D into research of those things. After the initial idea matures they are reliant on their contract manufacturer for technical innovation at which point they are limited to what said manufacturer is willing to sell to them. Are either of those tires meaningfully more technically advanced than what Panaracer sells? Or are they simply making known tradeoffs that Panaracer felt was not suited for their own product, market positioning and calling it “better”?
Lucky for us there are people both lab testing and trying to take measurements in the real world to try and give us more information on what is a “better” tire and when a tire might be better than another. In that light, Rene Herse and Ultradynamico seem like good but not great tires, with higher grip and more puncture resistant options available at the same or lower RR. Yes there is variability in that data but it clearly supports the notion that Rene Herse and Ultradynamico are just niche, expensive, Panaracer Gravel Kings with thinner casings.
Well said. I’ve been using all the slick RH tires since they came out but if I want peace of mind I run 27.5 x 2.0 Specialized Fastraks. I dont think they make the conti in a hot-chilli compound at 2.0
